Originally Posted by Silas Sydenham

Perhaps that is possible in the USA, but if gun gontrol is adequate, as it is in Australia, it is extremely difficult to acquire a gun. Thugs and criminals who think they need a gun have to go offshore to get one, and then risk being caught at customs.

They don't have a black market for guns at all in Australia? But of course, you're right in that if it's THAT hard to get one, it does put some controls on some of the psychos. Yep... we got problems here.

I bet I could go to any fair sized city in OZ and within 2 days tops, by poking around the right (or wrong depending on your point of view) parts of those cities, and having the funds to purchase, I could have all the firearms I could want. In ANY city, in ANY country, it would be the same. Its who you talk to, and how you act when you talk to them, so they dont think you are a cop.

And as PER USUAL with this, this bloody b*stard's face is plastered all over the news. GRRRRRRRRRRRRRR! How I hate that. I don't think they should do that.

You guys are probably right about the black market in weapons. But its pretty hard work in Oz to find (a) someone who has a gun, and (b) someone who is willing to sell a gun.
We have the advantage of no land borders, so our strict gun control works.
Acquaintances of mine have acquired guns, but find it impossible to get hold of ammunition.

You can go to a country town and buy a rifle or a shotgun, if you can prove by tax returns that you are a primary producer, but once again, ammo is in very short supply.

The Governor says: "this is a safe city, in a safe state, in a safe country". Yeah, right. This man is as delusional as the gunman.

Originally Posted by KAM

I bet I could go to any fair sized city in OZ and within 2 days tops, by poking around the right (or wrong depending on your point of view) parts of those cities, and having the funds to purchase, I could have all the firearms I could want. In ANY city, in ANY country, it would be the same. Its who you talk to, and how you act when you talk to them, so they dont think you are a cop.

You may get a gun or two in Oz under the table but to get all you want in two days......NO WAY NO HOW! No matter the wad of cash you had if you look at the stats as to the number available at any given time. Just on numbers alone you can get an idea as to why you will continue to see tragic events such as this prime time news.


A total of 2,750 seized firearms were recorded in the NFTD as of March 2012 (see Methods in first section on the compilation of this data). Where information was recorded on the date of seizure (n=2,341), all but 10 were seized between June 2002 and October 2011. Of the 10 that were recovered earlier, one was seized in 1977 and the others between 1995 and 1999.

The largest number of firearms seized as a collection was 102, recovered in New South Wales from individuals involved in firearms trafficking. Other larger seizures associated with SOCG included the recovery of 85, 45 and 35 firearms, all from entities involved in the illicit drugs market, and 60 firearms from a firearms trafficking venture. There was a small group of large seizures from non-SOCG too—55 unregistered long-arms from a licensed firearm owner in New South Wales and seizures of 21 and 22 grey market-sourced long-arms from individuals in Queensland.

Australian Institute of Criminology - Illicit market firearms and organised crime


Illegal Firearms for Sale... Concealable Hand Guns.

88% of all murders and violent firearms offences in the U.S.A in 2008 were carried out with handguns (ref: UNODC 2010 Report).

The U.S. market is far and away the largest as regards the number of armed civilians... it comes in at a whopping 270 million weapons. India comes next with 46 million, then China 40 million, Germany 25 million, Brazil and Mexico 15 million, Russian Federation 13 million, U.K. 3 million, Ukraine and Columbia also 3 million (UNODC.)

The UNODC 2010 Report describes "There is a large market in stolen firearms in the US: the FBI received an average of over 274,000 reports of stolen firearms per year between 1985 and 1994, most of which were handguns."

http://www.unodc.org/documents/data-...6.Firearms.pdf

I guess on a light note, you know no one is going to come play in your play ground to kick your butts any time soon.

Originally Posted by KAM

I bet I could go to any fair sized city in OZ and within 2 days tops, by poking around the right (or wrong depending on your point of view) parts of those cities, and having the funds to purchase, I could have all the firearms I could want. In ANY city, in ANY country, it would be the same. Its who you talk to, and how you act when you talk to them, so they dont think you are a cop.

You could here, but chances are you'd be consorting with people who are already under surveilance by the police.

I've been thinking about this over the past 24 hours. I think Silas is right in that properly resticted gun ownership with mental health checks and regular registration probably would have weeded this guy out from owning a gun legally. But I also think gooddog is right in that in this particular case, he would have found a way to get a gun somehow.

The issue I have with the widespread gun ownership in the US is the notion that it somehow makes people safer. It doesn't. It might make you feel safer, but it won't stop someone else shooting you - intentionally or by accident. When the number of guns in circulation is high, then the opportunities to acquire one legally or illegally is also high.

And while I'm here, I just want to say that the UK's homicide rate is now at it's lowest for 25 years, with 550 homicides last year. There are cities in the US with a fraction of the population of the UK (56 million give or take) that manage to reach that figure and more.

Prayer for the Dead

God our Father,
Your power brings us to birth,
Your providence guides our lives,
and by Your command we return to dust.

Lord, those who die still live in Your presence,
their lives change but do not end.
I pray in hope for my family,
relatives and friends,
and for all the dead known to You alone.

In company with Christ,
Who died and now lives,
may they rejoice in Your kingdom,
where all our tears are wiped away.
Unite us together again in one family,
to sing Your praise forever and ever.

Amen.

My pp wouldn't be in prison today if it wasn't THAT easy for a 15 year old to obtain a handgun illegally. Tragedy upon tragedy.

Originally Posted by peanut2

If someone had a hand gun in the theater which they do not, one shot could have saved many yet again.

He could have used a hand made bomb ( in both theaters), that would have taken out the theater on the other side of the wall as well and many more people in the orginal theater. They are still checking for booby traps at his apartment building.

Except that he didn't make a hand made bomb, he brought a gun. Bought 4 of them and SIX THOUSAND ROUNDS?!? And this country this is OKAAAAYYYYYY!!!!

And that kind of chaos that must have broken out, I'm sure gun toting citizens in a crowded movie theater would have saved the day. I'm not saying they couldn't have minimized the damage, however, a bunch of civilians armed to the teeth is hardly a panacea for these kind of issues. With cross fire and whatnot, there's no saying that they would have helped at ALL.

Where is gooddog? We need to find a peaceful Utopia.