Originally Posted by Selly

I don't think it did interest anyone to know when I posted a link to the very same article on page two of this thread. They just continued to harp on about prisons are not Hiltons and people can drink water. The issue isn't a case of comfort - it's a case of the temperatures becoming life threatening and fatal in cases that Smiley has pointed links to as well as Mountanddo and yourself.

It's clear that we form opinions in our own way and we choose how to inform ourselves.

When someone is imprisoned, being removed from society is meant to be the punishment. The institution has a duty of care to those imprisoned in that they need to be housed safely. I think many words have been put in the mouths of those who are arguing a case against extreme heat in prisons.

Selly, I'm sorry, I didn't realise it was the same link.

That said, I think the inmates also have a responsibility as well to make sure they drink when they are able to. Many don't - many think it is a sign of weakness. I am learning a lot about the field crews at the moment, and they appear to be accommodated with enough water regularly at Hubby's unit at least. But you can't force a horse to drink.

TDCJ unit housing blocks do have large ceiling fans. Individual inmates can purchase small fans for their cells if they have the money. For indigent inmates, TX CURE donate fans.

If it upsets people that much, donate enough money to TX CURE to purchase a fan.

Originally Posted by sunray's wench

That said, I think the inmates also have a responsibility as well to make sure they drink when they are able to. Many don't - many think it is a sign of weakness. I am learning a lot about the field crews at the moment, and they appear to be accommodated with enough water regularly at Hubby's unit at least. But you can't force a horse to drink.

J had told me that when he was working the fields at Angola they had adequate water, but some of the guys simply didn't want to work the fields (and they ALL have to work the fields when they first get there - it's initiative to behave work out of the working cell blocks to get to an outcamp and get other jobs), so the guys who didn't want to work wouldn't drink the water so they would have a medical issue. They didn't realize that they would get sent right back out from work after a day or so in the infirmary.

Originally Posted by Gerri

Now I am trying to navigate our purchasing department that has very
stringent rules about purchasing anything from a specific vendor since we
operate in a competitive open-market environment. I have drafted a
justification letter that I think will work and we should be off and
running. I spoke with the manufacturer this morning about their inventory.
He said they only have 2,500 available the first week in July and we can
have them all. In August though, they have 48,000 arriving, so we will be
in great shape. In meeting with my boss about this, we decided to only
mark this item up marginally as compared to our regular product line. I
purchased one of these at Academy right after you emailed me and with tax
it cost me $14.06. I would like to sell them in the commissaries for
around $8.00 (tax included). Depending on the freight charge to ship them
to us, this may go up some. I have received a lot of raised eyebrows over
this towel mainly for the bright color since we are such a color-neutral
group. However, I assured all of our decision makers that I have washed
several colors together with white t-shirts and there was no color bleeding
from any of them. After testing these towels for about a month, I feel
like I had given them a good test and could speak from experience when
addressing our directors.

This cooling towel will be classified as an emergency item on the
commissary list. Even if an offender is on restriction, they will be able
to purchase a towel. Each towel will have their number permanently marked
on it and it will be registered as one of their property items. We feel
this will be as important as their fan and want to protect them from losing
their towel by theft from another offender.

Hopefully we can buy these soon for our loved ones

You lost me???? Are you saying your trying to get a NEW product and VENDOR on the commissary list of TDCJ?

Little update......

Only 21 of the 111 prisons overseen by the Texas Department of Criminal Justice, the state prison agency, are fully air-conditioned. Many of the prisons that do have air-conditioning in areas where medical services or educational programs are provided to inmates do not offer it in the sections where they live.

Inmates and their families have complained for years about the heat and lack of air-conditioning in the summertime, but the issue has taken on a new urgency. An appeal is pending in a lawsuit initially filed in 2008 by a former inmate claiming that 54 prisoners were exposed to Death Valley-like conditions at a South Texas prison where the heat index exceeded 126 degrees for 10 days indoors. And several inmates at other prisons died of heat-related causes last summer; a lawsuit was filed Tuesday in one of those deaths.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/27/us...pagewanted=all

Originally Posted by smiley

Little update......

Only 21 of the 111 prisons overseen by the Texas Department of Criminal Justice, the state prison agency, are fully air-conditioned. Many of the prisons that do have air-conditioning in areas where medical services or educational programs are provided to inmates do not offer it in the sections where they live.

Inmates and their families have complained for years about the heat and lack of air-conditioning in the summertime, but the issue has taken on a new urgency. An appeal is pending in a lawsuit initially filed in 2008 by a former inmate claiming that 54 prisoners were exposed to Death Valley-like conditions at a South Texas prison where the heat index exceeded 126 degrees for 10 days indoors. And several inmates at other prisons died of heat-related causes last summer; a lawsuit was filed Tuesday in one of those deaths.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/27/us...pagewanted=all

Thank you smiley for posting this. Perhaps this might change the lack of sympathy that has been seen in this thread. I've never experienced such vehemence at caring too much about people's health and well-being especially from people that are otherwise, from what I've seen, such advocates for prisoners.

What i found interesting was this from the same article already posted.....

A Texas law requires county jails to maintain temperature levels between 65 and 85 degrees, but the law does not apply to state prisons. The American Correctional Association recommends that temperature and humidity be mechanically raised or lowered to acceptable levels.

So why would it apply to jails, yet not prisons???

I wonder if in part it is due to cost?

Well, I guess jails have inmates who haven't been convicted.............................

Originally Posted by Selly

Well, I guess jails have inmates who haven't been convicted.............................

That makes a lot of sense and is probably the reason.

Originally Posted by mountanddo

Thank you smiley for posting this. Perhaps this might change the lack of sympathy that has been seen in this thread. I've never experienced such vehemence at caring too much about people's health and well-being especially from people that are otherwise, from what I've seen, such advocates for prisoners.

okay, i'm going to pass on a little secret.

i have rarely ever advocated for betterment of prison conditions and i will tell you why.

because i know that the things prisoners whine about are over-exaggerated claims most of the time. they complain and over-exaggerate to get sympathy from kindhearted people, and sympathy usually comes in the form of more money or anything else they can use to benefit them. and 9 times out of 10, they don't need/deserve what they're demanding. i'll even go so far as to say that the maturity level in most prisons, amongst quite a bit of the population, is equal to that of a preschool.

they (when i say "they" i don't mean all of them, or even most of them) feel like the world owes them something. this is usually the population that is 18-30. once they hit 30 it's like they mature a bit but they still have this thing about them that i can't explain. they all think they're philosophers. they're all angry at the system that put them there. they don't want to take responsibility for their actions or even for themselves.

"society locked me up." no, you locked yourself up.
"society owes me more comfortable beds." no, you're lucky you get a mattress.
"i deserve more than a bologna sandwich for lunch!" no, our only responsibility is to give you a meal.
"they charge too much for phone calls!" at least you're allowed to make them. you don't have to call every day.

when i worked the mailroom there was not a day that went by without me seeing at least one letter being sent out to the ACLU to complain about something. they saw it as an infringement of their civil liberties because they didn't get pillows. one time the oven in the kitchen went out as they were cooking their lunch. the only other alternative was to feed them peanut butter and jelly sandwiches. do you know they had the nerve to tell the assistant warden that they should have ordered pizza to feed them because a PB&J sandwich wasn't a hot meal? they wrote to the ACLU about that. they wrote to the ACLU because the bars of soap they were given were too small. they wrote to the ACLU because visitation was conducted over video cameras. they wrote to the ACLU because they wouldn't call the doctor in to give them a damn band aid for a freaking paper cut. i could go on.

give me something seriously wrong - solitary confinement for extended periods of time, hepatitis C outbreaks, rape, beatings, moldy cells - things these guys cannot possibly prevent (in most cases) and i will rant about it. but when all someone has to do is something as simple as drink water to prevent something? no. i'm not going to be sympathetic. i'm sorry if this makes me a horrible person. the COs have to walk around in the same conditions every day in heavy uniforms, some even with extra padding like vests, depending on their unit/assignment.

i am sympathetic to the heat in the sense that i can feel their pain. as you may have noticed i've been working in an office without A/C all week when the temperatures hit highs of 100 every day. i have my little bitty fan that i showed up there. that's all i've got. i drink my water and sit at my cubicle (which causes my area to be even more stuffy) wearing my blue jeans. i know what it feels like to be hot. but i also have the common sense to cool off however i can. i know how irritating it is when you're hot! but i'm not going to sit here and cry for them because they got themselves thrown in prison and don't always have all of the luxuries those of us who aren't in prison have. do i think it's wrong they don't have air conditioning? i think it would be nice if they had it only because, like i said, i know how it is to be in the heat. i don't think it's something that prisons should be forced to have. did anyone ever think that maybe, in some cases, they're purposely not cooling off or drinking water because they want a quick trip to the infirmary where there is air conditioning? don't think it doesn't happen because i know it does.


that's my 8 cents because i wrote a lot and they wouldn't let me have 10.